Interest in a collaborative "Skating" rating?

[legionnaire11]

Skating has always been the hardest rating to come up with because there is no stat that correlates, and especially in modern times everyone in the league is such a great skater that it can be difficult to differentiate between most players ability.

However, the NHL does actually have stats on skating now via their EDGE system of player and puck tracking, they just don't make it publicly available. We do see it sometimes on broadcasts though as they highlight players and show their speed and other stats. I'm thinking that as a group collaboration, we could all pitch in by sharing these data points as you see them on broadcasts. If there are enough people contributing to this, we could really build a solid database on players Top Speed, Average Speed and Distance Skated. Even if not every player ends up being represented, having a broad database would allow for the gaps to be more easily filled in with the eye test.

For example on what the NHL has available: https://www.reddit.com/r/hockey/comment ... 3_regular/

Hopefully one day the league will make all of this data available to the public, but in the meantime I think a group of us hardcore sim nerds could really put together a nice, usable data set just from what is shown on broadcasts. I'm envisioning this as a shared document like google sheets or something, but if anyone has some halfway decent coding skills I think a simple wiki type app could be made.

Further thoughts and suggestions are welcome!

[Goldi48]

SK rating has in fact nothing to do with a speed of skating. SK rating is a part of decision making formula - it affects what player is going to do with the puck (shoot, pass, skate or puck handle). Additionaly, the higher the stat is, there is a less chance the player get hit.

That's why I think the proper stat for SK rating is puck control/possession time - the more time player has a puck on his stick in real game, the higher SK rating should be.

[BeardCommish]

We're using statistical analysis based on a player's ability (and various stats in this realm), relative size, and age. Overall, it's a pretty comprehensive stat in our ratings. And as Goldi mentioned above, in STHS, it's not about "speed", though you will tend to find fast skaters among those in the top of the SK rating in our pack.

Keep an eye out - we're due for a big announcement shortly on our first public ratings offering. We'll give as much detail as possible regarding our statistical approach then.

[legionnaire11]

SK rating has in fact nothing to do with a speed of skating. SK rating is a part of decision making formula - it affects what player is going to do with the puck (shoot, pass, skate or puck handle). Additionaly, the higher the stat is, there is a less chance the player get hit.

That's why I think the proper stat for SK rating is puck control/possession time - the more time player has a puck on his stick in real game, the higher SK rating should be.

I'm not doubting you, just wondering how this makes sense as in the manual Simon himself lists "Speed of player" as what you should base the Skating rating on if you are creating your own ratings.

Code: Select all

		Players CSV Version 2 Field
#	Stats			Base yourself on ** to create ratings.
1	Checking		Number of body check
2	Fight 			Number of fight
3	Discipline 		Number de penalty minute
4	Skating 		Speed of player
5	Strength		Physical strength of the player
6	Endurance		Endurance of the player
7	Durability 		Tendency to get injured
8	Puck Handling		Tendency to control the puck
9	Face Offs		Percentage of face off win
10	Passing			Number of pass
11	Scoring			Number of goal
12	Defense			Plus and Minus
13	Penalty Shots		Number of Penalty Shots Goal
14	Experience		Experience of the player
15	Leadership		Leadership of the player
16	Potential		Potential to become better

[legionnaire11]

FWIW I had also been thinking about zone entry stats for Skating. If there was a resource that show how many times each player skate the puck into/out of a zone vs passing it or dumping in.

[BeardCommish]

I'm not doubting you, just wondering how this makes sense as in the manual Simon himself lists "Speed of player" as what you should base the Skating rating on if you are creating your own ratings.

Code: Select all

		Players CSV Version 2 Field
#	Stats			Base yourself on ** to create ratings.
1	Checking		Number of body check
2	Fight 			Number of fight
3	Discipline 		Number de penalty minute
4	Skating 		Speed of player
5	Strength		Physical strength of the player
6	Endurance		Endurance of the player
7	Durability 		Tendency to get injured
8	Puck Handling		Tendency to control the puck
9	Face Offs		Percentage of face off win
10	Passing			Number of pass
11	Scoring			Number of goal
12	Defense			Plus and Minus
13	Penalty Shots		Number of Penalty Shots Goal
14	Experience		Experience of the player
15	Leadership		Leadership of the player
16	Potential		Potential to become better

Where is this located? The manual does not say this at all (the manual on his website).

[legionnaire11]

I'm not doubting you, just wondering how this makes sense as in the manual Simon himself lists "Speed of player" as what you should base the Skating rating on if you are creating your own ratings.

Code: Select all

		Players CSV Version 2 Field
#	Stats			Base yourself on ** to create ratings.
1	Checking		Number of body check
2	Fight 			Number of fight
3	Discipline 		Number de penalty minute
4	Skating 		Speed of player
5	Strength		Physical strength of the player
6	Endurance		Endurance of the player
7	Durability 		Tendency to get injured
8	Puck Handling		Tendency to control the puck
9	Face Offs		Percentage of face off win
10	Passing			Number of pass
11	Scoring			Number of goal
12	Defense			Plus and Minus
13	Penalty Shots		Number of Penalty Shots Goal
14	Experience		Experience of the player
15	Leadership		Leadership of the player
16	Potential		Potential to become better

Where is this located? The manual does not say this at all (the manual on his website).

https://sths.simont.info/ManualV3_En.php#RatingCreation

[doogiski]

FWIW I had also been thinking about zone entry stats for Skating. If there was a resource that show how many times each player skate the puck into/out of a zone vs passing it or dumping in.

This is what I use for SK in my ratings package. Corey Sznajder tracks this. I use controlled zone entries/60 for forwards and controlled zone exits/60 for defenders. The logic is that if a player has a tendency to skate a puck into/out of a zone instead of dump and chase or off the glass and out respectively, they probably have higher ability to process the game (an alternate way of viewing Simon's definition of "speed of play") that lends itself to SIMs decision making formula. In a way it's killing two birds with one stone.

Having said that, some here really poo-poo microstats such as this, but I'd rather use this quantifiable view of SK rather than an eye-base test mixed more proxy statistics.

In addition, I mix in ATOI during 3v3 play with the expectation that better skaters will be put over the boards with more open ice to play on.